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Old 08-09-2012, 01:49 AM   #61   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

Don't trust him, 1rst, beta weapons are not in the Test 1 files so it's impossible to get them in the game and second, all pics he posted on Facebook are not his own pics, but official pics posted by Croteam during the beta.
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Old 08-09-2012, 02:44 AM   #62   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

The pillar is interesting. My only guess is that Luxor's "rising tower" cutscene was supposed to happen at Karnak at one point. That makes sense, as they were both one level at one point.

However, I'm not sure about his claim about there being another level. Everything seems to indicate that only one level was in it. If there's a file that proves without a doubt that there was supposed to be another level, I'd love to see it. He's usually wrong as hell, but I'm willing to give him a little, little leeway because he found the pillar.

Generally, I'd say the rule of thumb is to be extremely skeptical about what he says. I think there's something genuinely wrong with him, because he's horribly obsessed with old SS1 protoypes, and is the master of making shit up. He thinks old screenshots are actualy protoypes that exist out there and will say shit like "I MUST FIND 1999 BETA!!!" because of some old screenshots he's found. He's been harassing Alen L and Roman Ribaric for a while about old protoypes, which is irritating for them.

As it stands, his "beta restoration" mods are a joke. From what I can tell, all he does is rip a few models from other SS games, then try to put them in SS1. Even his BFF, Justin Casin/BroNSisGaming, has called him out for getting things wrong. I can't wait for his "level recreations", which I imagine will be very-poorly made levels with mediocre recreations of pre-release screenshots in the middle of them for no good reason.

he also claims to be a "beta expert", but has never played, much less beaten, quite a few of the games he researches. This leads to some pretty funny stuff, like him claiming that the leaked protoype of unreal Tournament 1 is better than the final one, even though he has never played a match of the final one in his life. Christ, the UT99 proto is horribly incomplete and is useful for researching, not playing.

Last edited by Squadala; 08-09-2012 at 02:52 AM.
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Old 08-09-2012, 02:53 AM   #63   Add To Ignore List  
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Wink Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

Quote:
Originally Posted by Squadala View Post
The pillar is interesting. My only guess is that Luxor's "rising tower" cutscene was supposed to happen at Karnak at one point. That makes sense, as they were both one level at one point.

However, I'm not sure about his claim about there being another level. Everything seems to indicate that only one level was in it. If there's a file that proves without a doubt that there was supposed to be another level, I'd love to see it.
I don't trust him. In his last post, he is talking about you. He is saying that you are a douchbag, that you stole his pics (even if thoses pics are not his own). As I saw , you are a important, respected and helpfully guy in the Sam community, so I'm with you and I'm saying that he is lying. Btw, Luxor was supposed to be a part of Karnak map (KarnakTemple.lvl).
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Old 08-09-2012, 03:01 AM   #64   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

What is also interesting is the Texture folders in SS1 and HD for the individual maps. There's "Karnak", "KarnakApproaching", "KarnakEnterComplex" , but there's no Luxor. Also the Sacred Yards are called "ThebesNiceYards" (or is it "RichYards"? Maybe both.) and the Memphis levels Suburbs and Sewers are called "ThebesSuburbs" and "ThebesSewers", meaning those levels were most likely part of the Thebes part of the story, like Karnak or Luxor (since both of them are part of the ancient metropolis of Thebes).

In a way it makes sense, since originally Memphis was "CityEnter", "CityMiddleYards" and "CityObeliskYard" only.
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Old 08-09-2012, 03:13 AM   #65   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

Quote:
Originally Posted by Squadala View Post
The pillar is interesting. My only guess is that Luxor's "rising tower" cutscene was supposed to happen at Karnak at one point. That makes sense, as they were both one level at one point.
It's not that I like him or hate him, but it can't be Luxor, it looks pretty close, probably it's a scrapped obelisk?
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Old 08-09-2012, 03:13 AM   #66   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

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Originally Posted by Clonejac View Post
I don't trust him. In his last post, he is talking about you. He is saying that you are a douchbag, that you stole his pics (even if thoses pics are not his own). As I saw , you are a important, respected and helpfully guy in the Sam community, so I'm with you and I'm saying that he is lying. Btw, Luxor was supposed to be a part of Karnak map (KarnakTemple.lvl).
Hahaha wow. That's hilarious. If I'm thinking of the images he's thinking of, I didn't "steal" them at all. They could be found at Gamershell.com. I just found the watermark, then did a search there to find the original images without his markings on them. There is nothing wrong with doing this. Just because he found them first doesn't mean he owns them.

Either way, the kid's got legitimate issues. He really needs to chill. He's really, really good at jumping to conclusions and burning bridges with people that are sympathetic to his cause. Basically, he's the type of person you DO NOT want doing research on old stuff, like video game prototypes.
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Old 08-09-2012, 03:22 AM   #67   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

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Originally Posted by Squadala View Post
Hahaha wow. That's hilarious. If I'm thinking of the images he's thinking of, I didn't "steal" them at all. They could be found at Gamershell.com. I just found the watermark, then did a search there to find the original images without his markings on them. There is nothing wrong with doing this. Just because he found them first doesn't mean he owns them.

Either way, the kid's got legitimate issues. He really needs to chill. He's really, really good at jumping to conclusions and burning bridges with people that are sympathetic to his cause. Basically, he's the type of person you DO NOT want doing research on old stuff, like video game prototypes.
It's not he hates you (even after the things he wrote), but IIRC, it's because the thing he wrote and you got replying that he was an idiot, nobody likes being called idiots by other guys, I'm NOT defending him but makes me guess this is the cause why he hates you

THIS IS NOT AN EDIT: What does Douchbag means?

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Old 08-09-2012, 04:13 PM   #68   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

This kid officialy started a "beta remake" contest. Squadala team vs his team.

Last post on his Facebook page: "for:Jacob Cloutier & Squadala- I really want to do a contest, my beta team remaking the beta and your squadala team also doing it when we finish both lets give the versions to croteam and they will say wich is better, the looser has do delete or hide all the beta related pages and say that,he's lying!!! thats the only fair way to clear this!!!!!!!"


btw,Jacob is me
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Old 08-09-2012, 04:23 PM   #69   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

Pfffahahahaha.
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Old 08-09-2012, 07:54 PM   #70   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

Wow, what a coincidence; I'm working on my own beta remake as well! Since he's called me out, here's the design doc I'm using as a guide to make it. if even half of the stuff I'm working on get's made, it'll blow his beta remake out of the water! Some of it is not up to date, but it's a good gist of what I and others are working on. Enjoy!

http://www.mediafire.com/?ca2oiz5udn3izwd
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Old 08-09-2012, 08:56 PM   #71   Add To Ignore List  
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Question Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

Quote:
Originally Posted by Squadala View Post
Wow, what a coincidence; I'm working on my own beta remake as well! Since he's called me out, here's the design doc I'm using as a guide to make it. if even half of the stuff I'm working on get's made, it'll blow his beta remake out of the water! Some of it is not up to date, but it's a good gist of what I and others are working on. Enjoy!

http://www.mediafire.com/?ca2oiz5udn3izwd
WTF Seriously, is it really your beta plan ?? Look like a kid wrote this.
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Old 08-10-2012, 01:57 AM   #72   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

Shit Squadala - you take it one step further for sure! hahaha
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Old 08-10-2012, 02:14 AM   #73   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

Hey! This is one of MY design documents for a secret project. YOU THIEF!

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Old 08-10-2012, 08:31 AM   #74   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

I really would be happy if somebody made quality scrapped levels remake.
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Old 08-10-2012, 08:49 AM   #75   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

Well ZIM, I know Clonejac is doing one of the Karnak levels and I'll oversee it enough that it will be of quality. But even if it seems to be a lot, there's actually really just a few reference images that we could use recreating the lost levels, Karnak being the most complete of what we know. Not to mention the fact that CT does have some of the alpha level layouts and will most likely want to use them for a later game.
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Old 08-10-2012, 10:54 AM   #76   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

Quote:
Originally Posted by Solais View Post
Well ZIM, I know Clonejac is doing one of the Karnak levels and I'll oversee it enough that it will be of quality. But even if it seems to be a lot, there's actually really just a few reference images that we could use recreating the lost levels, Karnak being the most complete of what we know. Not to mention the fact that CT does have some of the alpha level layouts and will most likely want to use them for a later game.

Well, I cancelled the project. (I don't have many time) :/
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Old 08-10-2012, 12:14 PM   #77   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

Pity.

[grammarnazi]*Much time[/grammarnazi]
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Old 08-10-2012, 01:47 PM   #78   Add To Ignore List  
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Lightbulb Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

Quote:
Originally Posted by Danker View Post
The man behind SERIOUS SAM BETA Facebook page (thekazuya005) found something pretty important and interesting in Test 1.

- At one point Test 1 was supposed to have 2 levels, the one we know as Karnak and one of the Final levels which would include many scrapped weapons like the Ghostbuster Pipebombs and the Cannon (probably it contained nukeballs).

- He found something pretty interesting in Karnak, if you die, well you can see a hidden obelisk below the floor and he says you can find many scrapped stuff below it.

http://images.wikia.com/serious/images/1/19/Hidden_obelisk.JPG

- Sam's gloves were supposed to say COOL in Test 1 at one point.

Yep this guy has found some cool stuff in Test 1, I've never imagined this would've existed.

Credit him for this info (not me) i just shared

I think I know why there is an obelisk there. in the "FlyOverKarnak" intro, we can see an obelisk in front of the temple (like the final version of Karnak), but in the beta and demo version, the obelisk is not there. So maybe they hided it in the ground in the "playable" version.

EDIT: In SSHD, this obelisk is in the same position than the final Karnak level, but it is not there when you play (only in the "FlyOverKarnak" intro).
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Old 08-10-2012, 02:16 PM   #79   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

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Well, I cancelled the project. (I don't have many time) :/
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Old 08-10-2012, 02:29 PM   #80   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

I found some interesting info about that obelisk in KarnakDemo. The model is called "LoweringObelisk.mdl" and is a moving brush without a target. Since the levels of SSHD were converted as-is, this is actually in SS1 as well (just like how the hidden broken hole secret in Hatsepsut was also converted). It means, this obelisk was meant to move, either into the ground, or up from it.

Hmm I'm kinda interested in that remake of that missing Karnak level, so maybe I'll do it for my project. While there were four Karnak levels, I assume that three of them made into the game: "Karnak_Enter" and "Karnak_Enter_Complex" became Karnak, while "Karnak_Temple" became Luxor. "Karnak_Lake_And_Alley" is missing and probably the one with that rectangle lake. Which is actually an existing place in IRL Karnak, and is in SS3 on the level "Karnak2" aka "The Dark Bride".

EDIT:

Theory 1

After further analization, I've got reminded of the Test 1 text "The Karnak Temple Complex consists of four parts: The First Pylon, Amon Complex, The Sacred Lake and Main Temple of Amon-Rae." Then my list is kinda swapped around, as "Amon Complex" is the name of the folder that houses the music for Luxor. That could be the "Amon Complex". On the other hand there is a Shrine of Amon where the Statue of Amon lies, aka from Test 1: "In order to get into the Amon Complex, you have to find a golden statue of Amon located in the Shrine of Amon." Aka the list is:

Karnak = Karnak_Enter aka "First Pylon"
Luxor = Karnak_Enter_Complex aka "Amon Complex"

"The Sacred Lake" was cut, though it kinda makes a return in SS3's Karnak2 aka "The Dark Bride". This level is "Karnak_Lake_And_Alley". This is further evidenced by the fact that IRL, the lake that is located in Karnak2 aka "The Dark Bride" IS actually called as the Sacred Lake of the Precinct of Amon-Ra.

Now this is where it becomes interesting:
"Main Temple of Amon-Rae" is may not be missing. That level could be Metropolis. Why? Two things:

1. Metropolis is the level where we get the Amon-Ra item, required to summon and use the Sirian Spaceship.

2. We now know that the folders where the music of the game is stored retains the names of many old levels, "AmonComplex" "KarnakEnterComplex" (which is weird because they are the same, see Theory 2). There are three folders for the Suburbs, Sewers and Metropolis levels, which are "ThebesSuburbs" , "ThebesSewers" and "ThebesMetropolis", respectively. Karnak and Luxor are part of the great city of Thebes. So yeah.

Theory 2

From the Music folders alone, there could be another kind of list:

"Karnak_Enter" is Alley of the Sphinxes. The music folder for that level is called "KarnakApproaching" which is kinda similar.
"Karnak_Enter_Complex" is Karnak. The music folder named the same contains the music for the Karnak level.
"Karnak_Temple" is Luxor. The music folder is named "AmonComplex" sure, and is the music of both KarnakDemo and Luxor. This is further supported by the fact that IRL, there are no "Luxor" when it comes to a thing inside Thebes (though the modern city is called as that), but there's a "Luxor Temple". Then again, IRL there's no "Karnak" either, but "Karnak Temple Complex" and "Karnak Temple".

And again "Karnak_Lake_And_Alley" doesn't exists. Until SS3, basically. Considering the info we got from the SS3 DLC, that game would also have Abu Simbel, which was the Nile level from the Alpha pictures (which I'm also remaking as a reimagination; or more like, I'm making a level inspired by that Alpha version), which means it is true that Croteam is using old ideas from the Alpha in later games. Just like how in SSHD we got the Firecracker with the chainsaw, we got a reimagined Karnak_Lake_And_Alley in SS3 as "The Dark Bride" (if you think about it, there are two things about that level, a lake and alleys), and probably get a reimagined Abu Simbel as well.





Btw, the old SS version before Test 1 is really an Alpha version, not a Beta, dunno why everyone calls it that.
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Last edited by Solais; 08-10-2012 at 03:43 PM.
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Old 08-10-2012, 05:23 PM   #81   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

So, basically:
LotB Levels = 3 first levels from the early build
Karnak Enter = Alley of the Sphinxes/Karnak
Karnak Enter Complex = Karnak
Karnak Lake & Alley = The Dark Bride
Karnak Temple = Karnak?
Hatshepsut = Hatshepsut (Lol)
Pyramid Valley = The Great Pyramid
Intro And Waterfall Circle = Moon Mountains

And probably:
Tomb of Ramses II = Tomb of Ramses III
King Valley = Valley of the Kings
Terra And River = one of the SS3 DLC levels (or were you referring to another level when you said "Nile Level"? Because IIRC, Terra And River is a Water Planet level)

With so many level designs inspired/being from the beta/alpha, why pester Croteam do give us samples of how the levels used to be or the prototype (except for extracting material or codes, I suppose)? Seems like levels from the early build return as games progress. Now if only some enemy and weapon designs did so as well...
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Old 08-10-2012, 05:49 PM   #82   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

The Nile level aka Abu Simbel is featured on some alpha pictures and Alen confirmed that it is a level that was not in the level list found in Test1. It was actually before Karnak_Enter.

Karnak Temple is definitely Luxor, because the model name of the temple where we enter at the end of Karnak has a model piece called "Karnak temple top".
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Old 08-10-2012, 05:57 PM   #83   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

As far as I know, the original order went like this:

LotB= First three levels
Karnak Enter = Alley of the Sphinx
Karnak Enter Complex = Final Karnak up to the room before the pool.
Karnak Lake and Alley = some of the scrapped parts of Karnak, like the lake with the five oblesiks in the middle of it and the path to the pyramid that's far away in the final version of Karnak.
Karnak Temple = Luxor
Hatsheput = Duh
Pyramid valley = Not 100% sure on this one. Might be very early Great Pyramid, but there's a screenshot of Pyramid Valley in a pre-release editor shot that shows an area that doesn't match anythign in the final version.
Intro and Waterfall Circle= Moon Mountains
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Old 08-10-2012, 06:03 PM   #84   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

Well, if it shows just an area, then maybe it was part of Pyramid Valley, while other parts looked like the final version. Or just PV was much larger than TGP is and had more areas, but the ending or the arena were similar?
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Old 08-11-2012, 06:15 AM   #85   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

Alright, as I promised yesterday, here are my findings about Alpha Karnak, its fate, Why Sam never been to Luxor ever, the full layout of Karnak_Lake_And_Alley and the mystery of Babilon_Temple solved.

Let's start with the full top view of KarnakDemo, which I will call as "Final Karnak" from now on:

http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/5976/karnaklayout.th.png


Chapter 1: There is no Luxor

First let's look at the building we enter at the end of Karnak which is said to be Luxor, as we can see the rising obelisk. This fact is true, however it is not Luxor. The building sits in a place in the IRL layout of Karnak where IRL there is a temple called Karnak Temple. Familiar? Yup there was a "Karnak_Temple" level in the Test 1 level list, and it was speculated many times that "Karnak_Temple" became Luxor. However it is NOT Luxor. Luxor Temple, as it is called IRL, is nowhere near Karnak, as it sits on the shore of the Nile.
Another evidence that the level is indeed "Karnak_Temple":

http://img706.imageshack.us/img706/5456/karnakd1.th.png

Tl;dr, Sam never been to Luxor. Interesting similarity in geographical discrepancy, that in SS3, Sam never been to Luxor either; what we know as "Luxor" there is actually a mutilated version of the Precinct of Mut of the Karnak Temple Complex. The Sphinx alley at the end of Karnak2 aka "The Dark Bride" is the quite famous alley that leads to the Precinct of Mut. It doesn't help that the hologram in the Secret Tomb under the Great Pyramid shows the actual IRL layout of the Karnak Temple Complex. I think the level "Luxor" is only named that for nostalgia effect on players to remember a level named "Luxor" in SS1, which was also never been Luxor either.


Chapter 2: Reversed Temple

Let's analyze this Karnak_Temple a little. As seen on a few pictures, the layout of the level has been quite similar in its development. Here's a comparison:

http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/3418/karnaktemplecomparison.th.png

As you can see, the layout is similar to the final "Luxor" however it was a lot simpler in the Early Alpha, when seemingly all four of Karnak levels were one (from now named "Pan-Karnak" from Pangea). My speculation is that the layout was made into the more complex current one later in development when the level became separate.

There was also an interesting fact during the Early Alpha when Pan-Karnak still existed: The Karnak Temple was facing the opposite way. The current exit was the entrance, and the Rising Obelisk room was the second room of the Temple, then leading up to the current entrance of "Luxor". Here's some comparison pictures between now and then:

http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/2127/karnaktemplereverted1.th.png http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/148/karnaktemplereverted2.th.png http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/8413/karnaktemplecomparison1.th.png

Look how the background adds up to Final Karnak's background.

For more evidence, let's take a look at the Lakeyard in Karnak_Lake_And_Alley:

http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/2144/karnaklakeyard.th.png

If you look at the background, you can notice how Karnak Temple now faces the same and is detailed poorly the same as it is now in Final Karnak. This means that this picture wasn't taken during the Early Alpha, but the Alpha when Pan-Karnak was no more.
Here's a comparison:

http://img23.imageshack.us/img23/3880/karnaklakeyardb.th.png

Here's another picture of the lakealley. Mind how the background adds up with Final Karnak yet again.

http://img689.imageshack.us/img689/2505/karnaklakeyard2.th.png


Chapter 3: Lake Obelisk Shenanigans and the Mystery of the Babilon Temple



Ok, so let's go elsewhere now. This is the current location of the Sacred Lake:

http://img36.imageshack.us/img36/7586/karnaksacredlake.th.png

As you can see, the obelisks in Final Karnak are the same size and are further from each other than originally. Why? Because of a better "Background Effect". The "Background Effect" is a popular way for map editors to generate the feeling in the player of everything being connected. Many games and Serious Sam as well uses this effect by placing landmarks of another level in the background. This is why we know about "Karnak_Lake_And_Alley" in the first place: because of the background.

Now look at this picture:

http://img502.imageshack.us/img502/1879/karnaklaalayout.th.png

On the picture, we can see a complete Karnak Final, with pieces of "Karnak_Lake_And_Alley" in the background. On the little gray picture, we can see a complete Lake and Alley, with pieces of Karnak Final (Karnak_Enter_Complex) in the background. It is interesting how Lake And Alley was so close to being final, yet it was cut.

If you take a close look, you can actually see the whole layout of Lake And Alley, seeing a Djoser pyramid thing and the city exit behind it. If you really squint, you can see a sort of entrance to the pyramid and the everything after that being less developed. Meaning, the level ended there when entering the pyramid.

It makes sense from the level list and the Karnak description from Test 1. The level progression thus was the following:

Karnak_Enter = Alley of Sphinxes, as explained in the posts above this.
Karnak_Enter_Complex = "First Pylon" aka Karnak Final
Karnak_Temple = "Amon Complex" aka "Luxor"
Karnak_Lake_And_Alley = "Sacred Lake"
Babilon_Temple = "Main Temple of Amon-Rae"

"Wait what? Why it is named "Babilon_Temple" when it is in Egypt?" you can ask. You see, CT names levels even today in a very generic but straightforward way. "Karnak_Lake_And_Alley" is an evidence. So why the "Main Temple of Amon-Ra" was named "Babilon_Temple"? Look at the shape of the pyramid/temple. Isn't it familiar?:

http://img684.imageshack.us/img684/2701/karnakbabilontemple.th.png


Chapter 4: The Ressurrectioning


So here is it. Everything is revealed. As you will see soon, the original SS1's Karnak has a very similar layout to the IRL one, but it was later butchered. Babilon_Temple was the final level, leading to the same Sphinx alley that was in SS3's "The Dark Bride" which doesn't actually lead to Luxor, but another part of the Karnak Temple Complex called the Precinct of Mut.

But why these levels had to be cut? Why Karnak Temple became Luxor, which IRL doesn't exist as just that, but "Luxor Temple" which is located far from Karnak, at the shore of the Nile.

I think this was because of how the story changed. In Amon Complex the obelisk rises and calls the spaceship. This creates a sense of urgency in the player to "get to da spacesheep." Due to this, it would may look kinda weird that after this revelation, Sam would linger in the city for two more quite long levels (since Karnak and Amon Complex is quite long anyways). Not to mention, "Amon Complex" is kind of a nondescript name for such a "memorable" turn in the story. So it was decided that the Amon Complex will be the more unique sounding "Luxor". However, with the other two levels after it in still existing, it would make no sense that Luxor is really there where it is, the players could see it that what they left was the Karnak Temple. Due to this, and the aforementioned sense of urgency reason, Karnak_Lake_And_Alley and Babilon_Temple was cut. With this, the new "Luxor" seems to be a separate part from the previous Karnak, so the player doesn't question the geographical discrepancy.

So this is what happened to Karnak.


Here is the updated layout with notes and the IRL layout comparison:

http://img822.imageshack.us/img822/6084/karnaklaalayout2.th.png

I'm gonna remake Lake and Alley, this I decided. But I won't remake Babilon_temple, since we really know nothing about it, it will be made into an exterior final arena. This level will be part of my project where my Nile levels also belong. Since my Nile levels are too big for SSHD to handle due to a memory bug in the game, it is needed to be cut yet again. Due to this, the new first Nile level would end up as too short. So I decided that I will try to expand that level with the actual existing Luxor, so we can say that Sam was really there.
The level list will be the following:

Thebes - The Sacred Lake
Along the Nile - Luxor
Along the Nile - Abydos
Along the Nile - Lower Egypt

Btw, Sacred Yards, aka Rich Yards as it was called in the Beta seems like not-yet existing during the Early Alpha and the Alpha. Maybe it was made later, during the Beta.


Sequel Hook Ending: The Revelation


When I reached this part of the analysis, something just hit me. In the Serious Sam 1 Alpha, Sam first goes to a City (City_Enter, etcetera). Then he goes through tombs and finds a Secret Tomb (the last level of the tomb section on the level list). Then he goes to Karnak, then he leaves for Hatshepsut. I dunno what is the Pyramid_Valley, but let's ignore that for now.

Now, does this sounds familiar?

Yep, Serious Sam 3. In it, Sam goes to a City (Summer in Cairo to Under the Iron Cloud), then goes where the tombs are where he finds a Secret Tomb (Silent Riddler). Then he goes to Karnak (Unearthing the Sun to Power of the Underworld), and finally ends up in Hatshepsut.

Therefore: SS3 = SS1 Alpha.

Croteam always said that they'll be reusing old content in future games. Now we know.

Croteam, you magnificent bastard, I read your book!!!




So yeah. Kittens.

http://img802.imageshack.us/img802/5681/dscf2330l.th.jpg
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Last edited by Solais; 08-11-2012 at 03:34 PM.
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Old 08-11-2012, 08:57 AM   #86   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

Oh My... So SS3=SS1 Alpha! That's in fact really obvious if you think about it now...
Great finds Solais!
And yeah, kittens. :3
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Old 08-11-2012, 11:56 AM   #87   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

Great investigation. It was really interesting to read it. Thanks!
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Old 08-11-2012, 02:04 PM   #88   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

Well even if SS3 = SS1 beta Egypt and Babilon temple is the Babilon temple in SS TSE, I still wanna a remake of the beta. I mean an exact remake of the beta.
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Old 08-11-2012, 02:25 PM   #89   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

You misunderstood that part. Babilon Temple is not Ziggurat in TSE, that is the thing. I guess Croteam didn't know how to call that Djoser Pyramid, and the first thing they could think is "hey it looks like a temple in Babilon!" and hence the map name. But it is not anything from TSE.
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Old 08-11-2012, 04:52 PM   #90   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Scrapped Serious Sam stuff and beta info

What if Babilon Temple is where the spaceship was originally supposed to be summoned?

Here's my theory:

-Sam enters Karnak. Babilon Temple has the way to summon the spaceship, but the door is locked.
-However, the key is located in Karnak Temple. Sam goes there and retrives the key.
-With the key in hand, Sam goes to Karnak Lake and Alley, then reaches Babilon Temple, qwhere he summons the spaceship.

This mirrors the final version, where Sam needs to get a statue from the building across from the ankh-shaped lake to access the rest of Karnak.

When Babilon Temple was removed, they moved the summon spaceship cutscene to Karnak Temple, since it has a setpiece that's big enough to be used for a cutscene. Then, Karnak Temple was turned into Luxor.
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