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Old 07-25-2016, 08:03 AM   #1   Add To Ignore List  
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Question Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

Can someone summarize the current state of these projects. I think at one point I read Origins was supposed to be finished in end of 2015 and/or correlate with the release of Serious Engine 1 code. And now I see there is also a Serious Sam Advance remake in the works.
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Old 07-25-2016, 08:21 AM   #2   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

These things are managed by a small group of people, so I'd say "when it's done" reigns supreme. My campaign also doesn't have a release date because it's bad to have to break a release date promise. But we can't get much info about Origins for some reason. TNE HD is dead as far as I know because most of the group disbanded and the project leader had no more interest. There's some leaked pre-alpha floating around but unless someone is willing to pick it up it won't get finished.
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Old 07-25-2016, 08:59 AM   #3   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

Actually, TNE HD is something a lot of people want to continue, but the project leader is pretty much holding the last, most complete version hostage.
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Old 07-25-2016, 10:29 PM   #4   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

Dang, was so interested in tne.
I wish CT would do it.
I would pay.
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Old 07-25-2016, 11:06 PM   #5   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

I think Croteam ought to focus on developing new games rather than re-hashing spin-offs and fan-projects.

The sad truth about community projects is that many live to completion, and many just fade away after enough time.

Also, you can rig a Dolphin Emulator to play Next Encounter with PC controls fairly simply.
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Old 07-26-2016, 04:26 AM   #6   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sacorguy79 View Post
I think Croteam ought to focus on developing new games rather than re-hashing spin-offs and fan-projects.

The sad truth about community projects is that many live to completion, and many just fade away after enough time.

Also, you can rig a Dolphin Emulator to play Next Encounter with PC controls fairly simply.
Since when does Dolphin emulate a PlayStation 2 ? You mean PCSX2 ?
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Old 07-26-2016, 04:53 AM   #7   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

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Since when does Dolphin emulate a PlayStation 2 ? You mean PCSX2 ?
He probably meant GameCube version.
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Old 07-26-2016, 11:05 AM   #8   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

Yes, I was referring to the Gamecube version, which is arguably, the superior version.
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Old 07-26-2016, 11:50 AM   #9   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

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Originally Posted by Sacorguy79 View Post
Yes, I was referring to the Gamecube version, which is arguably, the superior version.
Pardon my ignorance, but what differences are there between the PS2 and Gamecube versions that makes one inherently better than the other?
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Old 07-26-2016, 12:21 PM   #10   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

Emulator-wise, I believe the Gamecube version is better, since Dolphin offers plenty of customization options with graphical quality and a simple-to-map control scheme for mouse and keyboard usage.

But for the actual console differences? I wouldn't know.
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Old 07-26-2016, 12:29 PM   #11   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

Last I tried Dolphin and Pcsx2 had pretty much the same kind of customization available. Higher internal resolutions, texture filtering, antialiasing and shader support for both, I'd put them on the same line as far as customization goes.

Regarding game differences, I think the GC version may have slightly higher quality textures somehow, think I read something about them having memory limits on the PS2.
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Old 07-26-2016, 12:46 PM   #12   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

Ah, I see. Very well, I retract my statement.
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Old 07-26-2016, 01:10 PM   #13   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

GameCube version is not only superior in terms of better optimisation when you launch it via emulator, but it's also better graphics-vise, using better shader effects and so on. The only gameplay difference between them is different weapons and DM-maps afaik.
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Old 07-26-2016, 01:56 PM   #14   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

Quote:
Originally Posted by FreekNik View Post
GameCube version is not only superior in terms of better optimisation when you launch it via emulator, but it's also better graphics-vise, using better shader effects and so on. The only gameplay difference between them is different weapons and DM-maps afaik.
This. Also, the GameCube had more powerful hardware so the textures are also in a higher resolution.
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Old 07-26-2016, 02:07 PM   #15   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

Good to know, if I ever get the chance, I may give TNE another whirl. I enjoyed it back in the day, but never did get around to beating it.
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Old 07-26-2016, 03:22 PM   #16   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

Does anyone know, or could anyone ask Croteam, what is the legal status of TNE ? Do they own it now like they now own SS 2 ?
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Old 07-26-2016, 05:23 PM   #17   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Solais View Post
Actually, TNE HD is something a lot of people want to continue, but the project leader is pretty much holding the last, most complete version hostage.
who's this? Who's the leader?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AntonioR View Post
Does anyone know, or could anyone ask Croteam, what is the legal status of TNE ? Do they own it now like they now own SS 2 ?
How did croteam NOT OWN SS2? They made it!
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Old 07-26-2016, 06:11 PM   #18   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

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How did croteam NOT OWN SS2? They made it!
Yeah, but it was funded and published by 2K. IIRC CT couldn't sell it on Steam until the license expired or something, I don't remember the details, maybe someone will remember it.

The publisher of TNE was acquired by 2K, and the original devs are no longer in business, so I wonder who owns the rights to that game; 2K, Croteam or someone else.
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Old 07-26-2016, 06:11 PM   #19   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

Anything that they didn't make alone is considered something that is legally not clear so that's why TNE will likely won't be re-released officially. Also, its devs are actually still in business, as far as I know.
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Old 07-26-2016, 06:17 PM   #20   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain_Russia View Post
who's this? Who's the leader?

As far as I know it's Greyson.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain_Russia View Post
How did croteam NOT OWN SS2? They made it!
I don't believe you quite understand how the games industry works. Usually when a game developer signs with a publisher they also hand over the rights to the IP along with publishing rights, that's sadly the way it works. BioShock got its name because LGS couldn't make a new System Shock, because some third party held the rights. F.E.A.R. 2 was to be called Project Origin at first because the publisher held the F.E.A.R. name, they later got the rights back and Project Origin became the subtitle. There are so much cases like these.

Croteam gave up the rights for the Serious Sam IP and publishing rights when they signed with a publisher, and with the development of Sam2 it was in fact 2k Games that held them. When Croteam was released from 2k Games, Devolver made sure to buy the IP rights off 2k as well. Right now Devolver holds the publishing rights to everything Serious Sam, but I think Croteam retains the IP. Not entirely sure about that.

As for The Next Encounter, the developer Climax Studios holds the game rights. I heard talks about bankruptcy and the rights to the game falling back to Croteam by default, however their website is still active and even lists Serious Sam: The Next Encounter, so I assume they still have those rights.
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Old 07-26-2016, 06:19 PM   #21   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

Not Greyson.


And yeah, I personally wish if IP rights not owned by creators would run out eventually after a period of disuse and fall back to the original creators. After decades, I'm still salty about the fact that SEGA still owns the license to Ecco the Dolphin, they don't want to do anything with it, but its original creator can't use it to finally finish up a trilogy that was cut short. Or to make a new one.


As for Devolver: Devolver Digital is a new sort of publisher, called an "Indie Publisher". They don't own any IP rights, and instead of them being in control of developers, like the regular publishers, developers can hire Devolver to help them with publishing and advertising. Devolver is more of a service.
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Last edited by Solais; 07-26-2016 at 06:25 PM.
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Old 07-26-2016, 06:22 PM   #22   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Solais View Post
Anything that they didn't make alone is considered something that is legally not clear so that's why TNE will likely won't be re-released officially. Also, its devs are actually still in business, as far as I know.
It seems you are right. The Wikipedia article is funny; it says Climax Group "was" a game development company, then continues to say how different branches got shot down during the years, and in the last sentence they only say "Climax Studios is still open" and link to it
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Old 07-26-2016, 06:30 PM   #23   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Solais View Post
As for Devolver: Devolver Digital is a new sort of publisher, called an "Indie Publisher". They don't own any IP rights, and instead of them being in control of developers, like the regular publishers, developers can hire Devolver to help them with publishing and advertising. Devolver is more of a service.
So they gave Croteam the IP back. That's nice of them. I know Devolver holds the exclusive publishing rights to everything Serious Sam right now, but are employed on a per-game basis for marketing.
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Old 07-26-2016, 06:32 PM   #24   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

Actually, it's not even that. Croteam could go full indie or change to another publisher any time. They just don't do that, because they are not stupid.

Devolver doesn't hold rights in the traditional sense. They only do that when paid to do so. The classic publisher-developer relationship doesn't exist with Devolver.
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Last edited by Solais; 07-26-2016 at 06:35 PM.
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Old 07-26-2016, 06:44 PM   #25   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

Devolver Digital seems to be one of if not the only publisher that actually gives a shit about games (the anti-Activision/EA if you will). Here's hoping they don't become "too big" and end up like the rest of them. Pretty hipster thing to say, yet irrefutable.
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Old 07-26-2016, 06:47 PM   #26   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

They refuse to become big. Since they formed, they only hired one single person, because it was REALLY needed. But none since then. They are still like a 6 person publisher.
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Last edited by Solais; 07-27-2016 at 03:01 AM.
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Old 07-26-2016, 06:55 PM   #27   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Solais View Post
Actually, it's not even that.
In short, it is actually that.

The fact that every Sam game on Steam has Devolver's name as publisher means they hold the publishing rights, regardless of whether Croteam can revoke those rights when they want. You can't sell a game without publishing rights, Devolver had to remove Duke Nukem 3D from digital distribution because their publishing rights expired. If you want to discuss technicalities, fine, but Devolver holds the exclusive publishing rights until Croteam says otherwise and not on a per-pay basis. That's the marketing aspect.
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Old 07-26-2016, 08:19 PM   #28   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Discy View Post
As far as I know it's Greyson.



I don't believe you quite understand how the games industry works. Usually when a game developer signs with a publisher they also hand over the rights to the IP along with publishing rights, that's sadly the way it works. BioShock got its name because LGS couldn't make a new System Shock, because some third party held the rights. F.E.A.R. 2 was to be called Project Origin at first because the publisher held the F.E.A.R. name, they later got the rights back and Project Origin became the subtitle. There are so much cases like these.

Croteam gave up the rights for the Serious Sam IP and publishing rights when they signed with a publisher, and with the development of Sam2 it was in fact 2k Games that held them. When Croteam was released from 2k Games, Devolver made sure to buy the IP rights off 2k as well. Right now Devolver holds the publishing rights to everything Serious Sam, but I think Croteam retains the IP. Not entirely sure about that.

As for The Next Encounter, the developer Climax Studios holds the game rights. I heard talks about bankruptcy and the rights to the game falling back to Croteam by default, however their website is still active and even lists Serious Sam: The Next Encounter, so I assume they still have those rights.
I knew about F.E.A.R 2 and so on, a guy called DXFan619 did a retro perspective on that franchise and covered all the legal grounds all well.

if there's something I don't get, why can't Dev's just publish their own games these days, if Steam makes it much more easier than the old 'retail' days.
Aside from that and console releases of course.

Again, your not taught this stuff in school, so how was I suppose to 'understand'.
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Old 07-27-2016, 12:43 AM   #29   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Solais View Post
They refuse to become big actually. Since they formed, they only hired one single person, because it was REALLY needed. But none since then. They are still like a 6 person publisher.
The inclusion of the word "actually" is unnecessary since your post is effectively in agreement with mine. If I said "they are going to become big", the inclusion of "actually" would have made sense, but I didn't.
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Old 07-27-2016, 03:01 AM   #30   Add To Ignore List  
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Default Re: Current state of SS Origins, TNE HD, etc...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Discy View Post
In short, it is actually that.

The fact that every Sam game on Steam has Devolver's name as publisher means they hold the publishing rights, regardless of whether Croteam can revoke those rights when they want. You can't sell a game without publishing rights, Devolver had to remove Duke Nukem 3D from digital distribution because their publishing rights expired. If you want to discuss technicalities, fine, but Devolver holds the exclusive publishing rights until Croteam says otherwise and not on a per-pay basis. That's the marketing aspect.
Ah, I stand corrected then.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain_Russia View Post
I knew about F.E.A.R 2 and so on, a guy called DXFan619 did a retro perspective on that franchise and covered all the legal grounds all well.

if there's something I don't get, why can't Dev's just publish their own games these days, if Steam makes it much more easier than the old 'retail' days.
Aside from that and console releases of course.

Again, your not taught this stuff in school, so how was I suppose to 'understand'.
Devs CAN self-publish, but that takes money, not to mention, advertisements also cost a lot of money. And even skill. And not all devs have those.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LordAngus View Post
The inclusion of the word "actually" is unnecessary since your post is effectively in agreement with mine. If I said "they are going to become big", the inclusion of "actually" would have made sense, but I didn't.
What are you talking about.
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